[Urbanstudy] Contextualizing section 377 in the complexity of urbanism

[solomon benjamin]

Hi,
I aggree with Curt about the need for greater
contextulization, and the point that this is one way
of viewing cities as places and locations which as a
dynamic help us frame what being 'urban' means, to
who, and the way authority and power gets played out. 

We could then link this with 377 or other issues, as a
way to open the discussion in a more meaningful way.
Would considering 377 in this way, allow us to look at
its local manifestations and subversion that moves
beyond a sort of binary of the 'Nation State" and
"civil society"? 

This relates to a more general point. One thing I am
struck by, is that we normally see 'authority and
power' in a sort of 'binary': One one part, the
'Nation state' -- either 'captured' in the hands of
the elite, and thus reactions to this being
'staratigic and explict' (by big business) or
'tactical' the latter being by a generally
dis-empowered lower class. Or then a nice cuddly
benovalent one that will act in 'public interest'
where via 'participatory stuff (planning, etc) it can
be appealed to solve a variety of problems. This can
be those of an unbirdled globalization, floods in
Bombay, communal tensions, and the list goes on.
Significantly, in both cases, 'planning' and the
advocacy groups take a sort of superior position
("...I speak on behalf of the struggling masses and
shall by way of my actions empower them and make them
concious of their situation...") or in the 'cudly
teddy bear state' be a urban designer or planner to
plan/ design our cities to be better places.

I wonder in contrast to such dualistic binaries, do
cities actually form more complex territories which
implicates not a "nation state" but as a complex of
layers of government where the line between 'the
state' and 'society' gets blurred. Not only that,
rather than a sort of improvished 'tactical' and
'reactionary' (after the fact) position that implictly
assumes a heiarchical city, do we have more complex,
fluid, muddy stealth like, encrochments, subversive
actions. In this non-binary view, deeply implicate
perhaps are those who claim to design, plan, empower.
Do cities then form locations of more complicated
notions of politics? 

Cheers
Solly



--- ninad pandit <furrylogic at gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear Curt,
> I understand your concern and also agree with your
> suggestion of not merely 
> posting bare petitions, but also backing them up
> with greater 
> contextualization. I did not imagine it to be
> necessary as this debate is 
> being adequately covered by the media, almost
> agressively so, especially in 
> Mumbai, but I do realise the necessity of not just
> posting petitions, but 
> also following it up with other debates relevant to
> the issues in focus. 
> 
> The Sarai Reader 05 has an essay by Ateya
> Khorakiwala that I found would be 
> interesting to perhaps begin such a debate. It looks
> at Hamsafar, a gay 
> support group in Mumbai, and examines how it uses
> micro tactics coupled with 
> sexual health awareness related work to negotiate
> its position in the city. 
> It looks at how, by merely defining itself as a
> sexual health awareness 
> organization that seeks to support amongst others,
> gay people, it has 
> managed to get substantial civic support, to the
> extent that they are 
> currently housed in an old Municipality Building.
> 
> The link for the essay is here:
> http://www.sarai.net/journal/05_pdf/07/04_ateya.pdf 
> 
> 
> Ninad
> 
> 
> On 20/08/05, Curt Gambetta <cugambetta at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> > 
> > Dear Ninad and Dr. Sridharan,
> > 
> > Thanks for your postings on the Urban Study Group
> > list. I am sure they raised eyebrows and provoked
> > questions for members on the list about what a
> list
> > like this is about, and what kind of discussions
> we
> > all seek to foster.
> > 
> > I would like to begin from the outset by saying
> that I
> > do not, as the moderator, censor any postings made
> by
> > group members. You all post directly to the list.
> I
> > think we all agree that an environment of openness
> is
> > beneficial to dicussions on the list, and I would
> like
> > to maintain that mode of operating, free of
> moderator
> > approval. Naturally, postings will occassionally
> slip
> > in that may or may not address the Urban Study
> Group's
> > intended content. I think it is best to live with
> > that, and continue to maintain this an open list
> to
> > group members.
> > 
> > I would like to address what I see as the larger
> issue
> > here. I have recently posted messages regarding
> list
> > content, in the hopes that we can keep our list
> > focused on cities and urban life. Many of us are
> > members of a number of mailing lists, and see it
> in
> > our best interest to keep this list focused on
> issues
> > that bring us together under the particular
> auspices
> > of urban studies and urbanism. I say this
> cautiously,
> > however, because we need to keep in mind, and
> always
> > remain open to, content or questions that are not
> > considered proper subjects of study regarding
> "urban
> > issues", such as sexuality. After all, urbanism
> and
> > urban studies itself is a relatively young
> phenomenon
> > in India, and should remain an interdisciplinary
> > platform that is open to new debates and new
> > questions. Part of the strength of a collective of
> > people joined together on a mailing list is that
> we
> > are able to reframe what constitutes "urban
> issues".
> > In order for us to be critical of the how the
> state,
> > the media and other forces construct notions of
> what
> > are supposedly 'proper' urban issues for study or
> > activism, then I would encourage us to remain open
> to
> > a diversity of perspectives. Sexuality is only one
> of
> > many of these important alternative lenses by
> which we
> > may read the experience of urban life.
> > 
> > However sympathetic I may personally feel about
> the
> > appeal against section 377, I do think it would be
> > productive for postings on this list to reflect on
> > what Section 377 has meant for the policing of
> public
> > space, as well as fostering in an extra-official
> > manner (rarely has it been implemented in court)
> > certain normative standards of behaviour. That
> said, I
> > think it would be best, if postings such as this
> are
> > to enter into discussion, to frame the issue being
> > presented for those on the list who are interested
> in
> > a politics of urban space as a contested
> landscape.
> > Though the list is oriented towards and research
> and
> > reportage, this does not mean that petitions
> cannot
> > appear on the list. Please, however, be sure to
> relate
> > the content of these petitions to a discussion
> that
> > group members can join in on. Tell us a little
> about
> > the history or politics of what you are posting,
> and
> > try to relate it to questions that interest list
> > members. I would prefer if list members did not
> post
> > 'bare' petitions, without any contextualization or
> > relation to list content. Please refer those
> postings
> > to other lists, where your readership will be more
> > responsive to the issue you are raising.
> > 
> > If you do not share this perspective, by all
> means,
> > say so!
> > 
> > Curt
> > 
> > --- ninad pandit <furrylogic at gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > Dear Dr. N. Sridharan
> > >
> > > I would like to disagree with you about this
> issue.
> > > The issue of Section 377
> > > impacts every individual, as it attempts to
> control
> > > behaviours of mature
> > > adults in public and private space. I therefore
> am
> > > unable to see how this
> > > issue is divorced from "Urban issues",
> especially
> > > when it is seen in the
> > > context of rampant moral policing in our cities.
> > > Section 377 represents yet
> > > another way in which personal expression is
> sought
> > > to be controlled by the
> > > state in our society.
> > >
> > > I would like to believe that the urbanstudygroup
> has
> > > mature and liberal
> > > members who would genuinely like to support a
> cause
> > > that is against personal
> > > freedom. If such an appeal is a misfit in this
> > > group, I believe we would end
> > > up using it merely to circulate our submissions
> for
> > > the Sarai Student
> > > Stipendship. I strongly feel that this group
> needs
> > > to grow beyond that.
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Ninad Pandit
> > >
> > >
> 
=== message truncated ===>
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